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May 29, 2009



Wow! What a picture. Constantinople/Istanbul looks like a richly gorgeous place. And how interesting that you're writing about both Eastern Orthodoxy and Islam today, since I've lately been wanting to devour more knowledge about both.

Some 20 years ago, I had a roommate who was involved with Reconciliation Ministries at 3101 Troost. A very interesting and devout young woman, who truly put her life on the line to reach out with God's love. I recall coming home from work one day to find a drunk man sitting on our couch. She'd brought him in to witness to him, but then she couldn't get him to leave. She came to me as I was getting ready to go out, wondering what to do.

I advised her to call the police; she didn't want to. And I said, "Well, I'm going out for the evening. I hope he's gone by the time I get back." I guess you can tell I went through phases in my Christian walk ... having such a, well, intensely-Christian roommate put me in a somewhat rebellious state. I.e., once when she went out of town, she told me I could watch her TV but only if I didn't watch anything secular. I'm normally so honest, so I'm ashamed to confess I switched the channel ... and one of her friends called and said, "Hey is that The Simpsons I hear in the background?"

So of course he told her about it. And when she confronted me I said Yeah, I'm sorry, it was just so tempting. And what more could she say? (Continued)


(Continued) So, all this to say that my devout roommate was all into Reconciliation Minstries -- but then the leaders felt called to go Greek Orthodox. So she felt like she needed to look for a new church home. Anyhow, a while back when I looked to see what Eastern Orthodox churches were in our area, St. Mary of Egypt pops up -- and it's also still got Reconciliation Ministries as an outreach. Pretty interesting site; I'll put the link at the end.

I've also been learning more about Asra Nomani. I started a thread about her in the Religious Studies forum at a mothering site I go to, and the discussion is getting pretty interesting. At first I just heard from two Muslim women who are not too crazy about her -- but today someone came on who really likes her. She said what people are objecting to is not that she doesn't know Islam -- but that she thinks for herself. And she provided a link where you can read lots of Ms. Nomani's articles. So I'll give the link for St. Mary of Egypt first, and the link for Asra Nomani second.

Then third I'll give a link one of the Muslim woman gave me to help me understand why there's so much disapproval of Ms. Nomani.





Some Muslims don't like the way Ms. Nomani references her past choices, because they see it as a central teaching that you just DON'T do that: It's seen as vain talk. The link explains it better than I can -- and it also mentions the concern that the more people talk about their sin, the less bad other people feel about sinning.

This is similar to an attitude I've heard expressed in conservative Christianity -- that the best way to prevent sin, is for people to feel really awful about it.

Since some have accused Ms. Nomani of "advertising" her past sexual choices, I wondered if she'd gotten graphic or something -- but it looks like all she has done, is pretty-openly share some really unwise choices she's made regarding men.

But since she's willing to share this personal information, maybe it can be helpful to other women who've had similar experiences of being used and dumped. Because when a beautiful and successful woman like Ms. Nomani has been rejected like this, you realize it's not some insufficiency in her, but rather the men she has chosen.

So maybe the other women can realize it's nothing lacking in them, either, and they can start making better choices in their lives.

Will Graham

Susan, I made a sincere offer, so I am sorry you are not able to accept it.

But, frankly, I am not interested in getting together with people who will not withdraw claims that my friends and I are delusional and psychotic.

In fact, I wonder why you would even want to get together with people who were delusional and psychotic? Perhaps to ridicule them futher? That is what Iggy did to the uncle of a friend of mine.

So, the more I think about it, I think I like the "Friends of Iggy" just the way they are.

You are doing a fine job.


I’m all for moving on, Susan.

Peace For the Sake of Goodness Cole

IGGY - www.KCFreeThinkers.org

Susan, I am all for moving on.

Some remarkable stats for crazy Xians
- most if not all scientific crap in the Bible has been debunked again and again - The Bible has real stuff but also do Superman's comics - check out C.R.A.P debunked on KCFreeThinkers.org site for "Creationist Astronomical" Pearls debunked.
- 70% of Americans don't want Roe v. Wade overturned
- 60-65% of young people are for gay marriage while only 20-25% of folks 50/60+ are for it
- the higher education you have, the higher income you make the less religious you are and less prone you are to influence of the Bible derived comic hero "space daddy" Yahweh and his side kick Jesus
- religion is losing all over the world
- and last but not least, prove to me that leprechauns are not little angels sent by the Flying Spaghetti Monster to save the world and you'll have my Xian vote.

I am glad and thankful that some 300-600 peple (mostly Xians) reading this blog can be hit in their "delusional brains" with hard core "reality based information" like this and next time they think about a silly religious thing to say they may think twice?

Mind you there are no "normal" people :o) - we are all delusional in one way or another, some of us just get hung up on one compartment in the brain and think that an alien Yahweh controls our lives.

By the way, if there was nothing when this space daddy was floating around nothing where did all the energy and matter come from? If nothing cannot come from nothing, then something (god) had to come from somethign?

Just questions for Xians to ponder - don't get too comfortable with your version of fortune telling.

The times of your religion being "right" are a-changing.

Dolores Lear

On my post yesterday, I made an error saying Evolution Theory began in the 1500s, I meant 1850s.

My Granddaughter is here from California, and I did not get to post last night.

Susan. Yesterday.
"Take my view that Jesus' work on the cross was/is sufficient to reconcile the WHOLE WORLD to God, whether believing or unbelieving: Someone the other day equated this view with "denying Christ. -
So maybe what we can start is a pretty cool friendship -- where we just both agree to disagree and accept one another as we are."

"Susan, I am all for BEING FRIENDS and AFFIRMING LIFE?
I will start by apologizing for being abrasive; how about you Friends of Iggy starting by withdrawing all claims that believer are "delusional" and "psychotic".
Sound good?
Lets do it!"

I hope I have not made rude remarks about anyone on the Blog. I enjoy all the different views given to us, by our Parents and our Environment. I would like to get together again.

I accept a Peace Jesus, and the Peace Father of Life on Earth in Genesis. Not as Religious, but a Human Peace Lifestyle.

These High Tech Peace Humans, in our Image, have found the Way to High Tech Science Eternal Physical Life After Birth, on Planets and in Spaceships.

Fallen Humans will continue being Killers, instead of Caretaker of their Home Planet and the Life on it, because of Unequal Human Birth Practices, since Cain and Abel.

High Tech Reproduction makes Peace Humans. Body Birth Reproduction makes Killer Humans. The Bible Proves this.

Body Birth Fallen Humans, do have the Planet ready for the Judgement Day Planetary Fire, with Pollution and Nuclear Bombs on land and sea. Why? Because of Religious differences.

Is it possible for the Divided Humans on Earth, to return to Peace and Love for our Fallen Brothers/Sisters of Body Birth, and not Kill our Home Planet and All the Life on it?

Dolores Lear

"I want to drop back a bit into history and take note of something that helped to shape the world we know today. It was on this date in 1453 that Constantinople, which had been the headquarters for Eastern Christianity since 324, was conquered by the Turks, who renamed it Istanbul and it became capital of the Ottoman Empire."

The picture of Constantinople/Istanbul is impressive for me. It looks like a big cathedral surrounded by Multi-stage Military Rockets. Why?

For me most temples and religious buildings have steeples that resemble Military weapons. Why? That is not what the God of Love is all about.

All these Religious Countries, including the Christian USA with Jesus the Prince of Peace for their God, have weapons of massive destruction.

Why do Religious Humans talk about Peace and then Kill Each Other and their Home Planet?

What is the Religious lessons of: Love God and Love our Fellowman, have to do with Government Weapons of massive destruction and Nuclear Bombs?

Who are Humans following on Earth? The God of Love and Equality of All Humans, or Man Made Killer Religions and Governments?

Why do Citizens give their first allegiance to Country over God? Because of Who are parents are, and our Environment?

Why are there so many countries and religions around the Earth. Earth should have one Society of Humans, all with Equal Birth, not all the Divided Groups made by Heterosexual Body Birth.

The Lord God in Genesis, is our High Tech Ancestors in our Human Image. They are Living High Tech Humans, with Equal High Tech Birth, and Eternal Physical Life After Birth, on Planets and in Spaceships.

Humans do need a High Tech Science Translation of Religious Writings and Myth.

This is the High Tech Peace Information for Eternal Physical Life After Birth, in the Christian Bible, and all Scripture and Myth.

Just Thinking

The issue of how Christianity became the official religion of Rome is a testimony to God's power. God's power to transform does not come by violence, but by submission.

Here you had a place where Christians were being killed in games, for entertainment. Many were being crucified. Some became human torches for Roman gatherings. But God showed His power and desire by turning Rome, the seat of the Roman Empire, into the seat of Christianity. Only God could turn a place so powerfully opposed to Christianity and Christians into a seat of Christianity without a revolution or war. It all happened voluntarily!

That's the way it is with God's Kingdom. God's Kingdom power does not come by violence, but through those who voluntarily turn their lives over to the Lordship of Jesus Christ. The power in God's Kingdom is not in dominance, but rather in submission. Rome became an example of how God's Kingdom comes to Earth.

The first significant split in God's Kingdom came when the Church at Rome insisted on cementing its power by declaring the Bishop of Rome to have a permanently higher position, called Pope, within the Church. But the seat of God's power is not found in being served through political posturing; it is found in submitting and serving. Rome's blustering did not increase the power of God's Kingdom, but instead dimished it. The Church eventually split into Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox because of this power grab.

Ironically, the Roman Catholic branch claimed that the power grab was necessary in order to preserve doctrinal purity; it is ironic because the Eastern Orthodox has remain virtually uncorrupted, while the Roman Catholic grows increasingly perverse.

It's a lesson for all Christians: purity doesn't come by domination. Purity comes by repenting and serving Jesus Christ as Lord.

Dolores Lear

Until all teachings of Scriptures and Myth, about a Peace God and a Killer God, as the same God are disproved, Humans will talk about Peace for the Sake of Goodness, like Cole states.

Just as on Bill's Blog there are many different theories on How Life began on Earth, and what is the proper Lifestyle of Humans, this was learned at their Birth, and in their growing up Environment, like all Humans born on Planet Earth.

With a High Tech Translation, there is a Peace God, in our Human Image, that Colonized Earth, and Reproduced Equal Male and Female Clones, 'Supernaturally' by High Tech Science, not by Body Birth.

When the Clones started Reproducing Unequal Male and Female Children, Killing began on Earth, and an Unequal Unsharing Lifestyle between male and female, with Killing Lifestyle began.

Why do Humans think GODs Resources on their Home Planet are for Sale? They should be Equal for All, if God is a Good Peace God, instead of an Evil Killing God.

What is the History of Religion on Earth? Humans Killing in the name of God or, in the name of their Country? Why?

There cannot be Peace and Eternal Physical Life After Birth, until Humans return to the High Tech Male and Female Reproduction in Genesis, that makes Equal Male and Female Helpmeets, not Unequal Mates.

Why these Helpmeets became Natural Mates, like Animals, is the Answer to this Killer Human Species.

Eternal Physical Life After Birth, can be the Hope of All Living Humans today, not Eternal Life After Death in Heaven. What is that?

What is Life After Death, but the Return to GODs Universe Elements, that are in All Life as we Know it? This is the Heaven Storehouse of Elements.

Eternal Life is for GODs Elements, visible and invisible. Humans can have Eternal Physical Life After Birth for All, with High Tech Science, and Controlled Reproduction on Planets and in Spaceships.

adam harrison

I am glad to here you are moving on, Cole.

You constant refrain that beleiver were delusional and psychotic was getting boring.

So, sounds great that you won't be making those claims about your new friends!

Just Thinking

Susan, thank your buddy Iggy for causing Bill to have to moderate comments on this blog. Bill was tired of being spammed by Iggy. You can't possibly defend what Iggy and "Friends of PIggy" have done in this blog to Bill. Bill Tammeus did nothing to deserve the inconvenience caused by PIggy Spam, and that inconvenience has been considerable.

Etymology: from a skit on the British television series Monty Python's Flying Circus in which chanting of the word Spam overrides the other dialogue.

Spam is an attempt to shut everyone else up by drowning them out, which was PRECISELY the stated goal of Iggy. Iggy used the words "shut up." So, if you're going to feign ignorance and stupidity, Susan, which you do quite well, then at least you've been informed now. Don't pretend that you haven't been told.

Iggy used to threaten to publicly videotape people without permission, which he is legally entitled to do, I suppose. His expressed intent was to shame people into submission. That's how your friend Iggy works. Iggy harasses people in Churches, in Bible Studies and wherever else he wants to soil people with his PIggy Pen. There is no way I'd show up to meet any of Iggy's friends, not with tactics like his. With Iggy's obnoxious, undisciplined tendencies, I wouldn't want to accidentally get in front of his car if he were mad at me either.

You are known by the company you keep, Susan. If you are a "Friend of Iggy," then your long, irrelevant posts should be interpreted as spamming, too. Don't think we haven't notice that your spamming ALWAYS starts when the discussions start to expose how illogical or ridiculous some "Friend of Iggy" looks. Burying issues behind spam is a favorite "Friends of Iggy" tactic.


Will, I am not sure why you say I am not able to accept your offer of friendship? I feel sure I have never called anyone here delusional or psychotic.

And I have said *I* was willing to move on without requiring apologies from those of you who have been unfairly accusing me of dishonesty, over and over again.

I just thought that maybe if we met the actual PEOPLE behind the names, we could all start showing more respect to one another. I honestly feel that I HAVE always attempted to be respectful of everyone here (but I'm open to being proved wrong). Though I certainly have described certain ideologies as harmful, I feel I've also made clear that I think most of the people IN those belief systems are sincere, and the fear they are passing on, is fear they feel is essential for the soul's wellbeing.

When I have personally criticized one of you, such as JT most recently, I have attempted to be constructive. I.e. I have said that I think J.T. is intelligent and has some good things to say. It's his compultion to try to win at all costs, that has him desperately lashing below the belt when he realizes his literary skill isn't totally persuading his opponent to think just like him.

Here's another go at that last link from last night --



It sounds like those of us who want to can plan another get-together.

Just Thinking and whoever else is offended with Iggy or anyone else here -- why not just take it up with the individual person? It's true that I've met Iggy and he told me about this blog (I've never tried to hide this either). But as far as you guys thinking we are some uniform group calling ourselves "Friends of Iggy" or "Friends of PIggy" -- I see myself as an individual who is enjoying getting to know various people who post here, but I post my own thoughts without running them through anyone else, and others post their thoughts without running them through me.

And since you're labeling MY posts as "spam" or an attempt to shut others up -- the fact that you label Iggy's the same way makes me more sympathetic toward him than not. After all, I think many of your posts are, figuratively speaking, an attempt to grab your opponents by the balls and squeeze as hard as you can -- but I try to give you the benefit of the doubt, and tell myself you mistake your penchant for winning for godly zeal. And I don't accuse you of "spamming."

It's okay with me if the friends of "Just Tactless" opt out of getting together with everyone. We'll probably post the time and place anyway, so anyone's welcome if they change their mind.

adam harrison

Just Thinking's 10:51 A.M. summation of Iggy's motives and methods is the best I have seen in months.

And you knew this, Susan, because you knew Iggy long before you came here.

One of the nuttiest things he ever did was tell a friend of mine, if she wanted to know where the secret bible study was, to meet him in a parking lot with her blinkers on!

When she blogged about it, he was enraged! It warmed my heart.

That you are not on the level is shown by the fact that you never condemn his gang for the slanders about delusions and psychosis, but have no compunctions about smearing "fundamentalists", etc.

Susan, its over. We are all on to your game.

adam harrison

Iggy's remarks about the "300-600" people reading this blog are ludicrous.

Sure, they are reading BILL'S Posts, but his assumption that they are reading the comments is erroneous, given the page views and time spent on them.

Further, this only underscores the fact that IGGY FAILED IN HIS ATTEMPTS TO GET THE KCFREETHOUGHT SITE UNDER HIS CONTROL...which has been all but abandoned as the atheists turn to the CHRISTIAN blogs and places like KCStar Faith Walk.

Of course, he does not seem to realize that the Christians I talk to who do look at the comments, find his broken record comments about the FSM, ALIENS, and half baked science laughable.

His methods failed in Belarus.

His methods will fail here

Maybe- Maybe Not

This amazes me. People who come to a Christian blog to to further their athiest agenda. You know what amazes me just as much though? Christians who go to the same blog, just to be nasty judgmental people.

I thought God hated that.

I'm just sayin.

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